Interview: Kevin Eastman (TMNT)
The Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles are turning 30, so Heath McCoy talks to Turtles co-creator Kevin Eastman in advance of his appearance at Calgary Expo.
When friends Kevin Eastman and Peter Laird self-published the first issue of Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles back in May 1984, world domination was the furthest thing from their minds.
“We did it for ourselves, creating what we wanted to see in comics,” says Eastman, in an interview from his San Diego home.
A 21-year-old short order cook at the time, Eastman swears he was shocked when all 3,000 printed copies sold out within a few short months. “The distributors were calling us saying ‘When is issue two coming?’” he recalls. “We didn’t even think about doing a second issue. We didn’t think people would buy the first one.”
In fact, a lot of people were soon clamouring for Ninja Turtles — namely the proverbial American household. By the decade’s end the four wise-cracking, crime-busting, pizza-loving tortoises were a genuine pop culture Tyrannosaurus. Movies, toys, cartoons, breakfast cereals — you name it, the Turtles owned it. An entire generation of kids grew up with the heroes in the half shell.
The Turtles’ popularity faded significantly by the latter half of the 90s, but now, three seasons into a hit cartoon on Nickelodeon and a comic book series with IDW Publishing, you can call it a comeback. And, if this summer’s Michael Bay produced Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles movie, due Aug. 14th, packs the blockbuster punch of such Bay hits as Transformers and Armageddon, the franchise may wind up being bigger than ever.
So when the spoils come pouring in for his co-creation on its 30th anniversary this year, is Eastman in for a sizable slice of the pie? “I jokingly say, I wish I made the money people think I made,” he says good-naturedly.
In fact, Eastman sold his interests in the Ninja Turtles to Laird in the late 90s and eventually Laird himself sold ownership to Viacom/Nickelodeon.
Today, Eastman finds himself working for the franchise he co-founded. He contributes to the IDW comic series and was also brought in for story consultation and development on the upcoming movie. None of that translates to a cut of the movie’s profits though, says Eastman. But that’s something he seems at peace with. Actually, he insists, no longer being in control of the entertainment giant is a “massive relief.”
When Eastman and Laird created the Ninja Turtles from their New Hampshire-based Mirage Studios, it was a pure labour of love for the lifelong comic fans. Indeed, TMNT started out as a clever parody of the hottest comics of the day. Teenage mutants were all the rage in a market dominated by X-Men. Artist Frank Miller had brought his ninja obsession to the forefront in the pages of Daredevil. Then there was the absurd, irreverent twist of embodying all of this in a gang of turtles. Could there be an animal less applicable to super hero adventures? (Maybe an aardvark. Canadian Dave Sim’s Cerebus the Aardvark was also a major inspiration).
On a roll, the two fledgling creators named their Ninja Turtles after renaissance painters: Leonardo, Raphael, Michelangelo, and Donatello, each modeled after prototypes found in almost every super hero team of the day (the leader, the berserker tough guy, the joker, and the brain). The comic became a cult sensation and within two years the self-made men were selling about 150,000 copies per issue, “making more money than we ever imagined,” says Eastman.
Agents began approaching the pair, the offer on the table usually amounting to, as Eastman recalls it: “Hey, sign me all your rights, and I’ll try to sell this concept.” But Eastman and Laird were very aware of their comic creator idols who had been so taken advantage of over the years, such as Jack Kirby, who co-created half the Marvel universe while retaining no rights to his characters. “We wanted full control and we were cocky,” says Eastman. “We said no to many agents.” Finally they found the right partner and the Ninja Turtles’ marketing juggernaut was born.
As TMNT became a mainstream sensation, some fans of the original indie comic could be heard grumbling that the characters they loved had become too silly, watered down for the kiddie set. In came the Turtles’ pizza obsession, the wisecracks, and their ever-repeated “cowabunga” catch phrase. But Eastman stresses that he and Laird felt this was a necessary evolution. “When we got into the licensing world, we knew we had to develop the show for eight-year-olds,” he says. “We knew the edgier stuff from the early books had to be softened. . . . For the first 15 years of mass media Turtle history, we had full control over what was done.”
Eventually though, the grind of piloting the TMNT franchise wore Eastman down. “In ’87-88 we were dealing with the business side of things 10 per cent of the time, and mostly focused on writing and drawing,” he says. “A year later, we were spending 90 per cent of our time with the business and 10 per cent being creative. We worked 20 hours a day for years. We managed the worldwide licensing program. We worked on 300 cartoon episodes and three live action movies. We ran everything. It got to the point where we weren’t having the fun we used to have.” Burnt out on his own co-creation, Eastman’s creative passions began to drift.
Where Laird’s influences tended to be more grounded in the realm of mainstream comics, Eastman, the younger of the two by eight years, always had one foot in the edgier world of underground comics. In the early days, that was the key to their winning chemistry. “I had one version of the Turtles that I wanted to do, and he had another, but we always met in the middle and made the stories work to satisfy us both,” Eastman says. “That’s what made the Turtles so cool.”
But by 1990 the ever ambitious Eastman was growing restless and he took over the adult-oriented sci-fi/fantasy magazine, Heavy Metal, which he still publishes today. By the late 90s, when the Ninja Turtles fad had cooled significantly, Eastman decided the time was right to sell his interests in the creation — perhaps not the best move in the long term. If he has any regrets though, Eastman doesn’t let on. He remains upbeat and incredibly driven. For years he’s been trying to bring his beloved Heavy Metal property to television, while re-establishing it on the big screen (following Heavy Metal movies in 1981 and 2000).
He’s also excited to be working with Laird again. The pair recently collaborated for the first time in about two decades to produce a cover for the 30th anniversary TMNT comic book, which will hit stores in May.
Even though he no longer legally owns his famous creation, Eastman takes pride in its legacy.
“That’s the important thing to me,” he says. “My wife and I are doing 17 comic conventions this year. To sit in a room with thousands of Ninja Turtle fans makes me feel incredibly overwhelmed and grateful. You almost feel unworthy. I’m seeing the original fans, who now have children, and their children have become fans. They all come to share the love. These incredible fans have given me such a great life.”
Kevin Eastman will be appearing at the Calgary Comic and Entertainment Expo, April 24th – 27th at Stampede Park in Calgary.
About the Author
Heath McCoy is a journalist, author, pop culture/trash culture junkie, and communications pro. Former music critic/pop culture reporter for the Calgary Herald. Wrote Pain and Passion: The History of Stampede Wrestling. TV show host and movie critic (seriously, once upon a time, a show you've never seen). Lover of comics, pro wrestling, and metal. He also enjoys scotch.
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